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| ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... | |
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كاتب الموضوع | رسالة |
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Fawzy
خبير استراتيجي
الـبلد : العمر : 45 المهنة : الادارة المزاج : Rothmans التسجيل : 19/08/2007 عدد المساهمات : 2069 معدل النشاط : 684 التقييم : 116 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| موضوع: رد: ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... الجمعة 21 أكتوبر 2011 - 19:30 | | | - النمر العربي كتب:
- ههههههههههههههههههههههه
منذ متى مصر او اسرائيل تصنع صواريخ اتمنى ان نكون واقعيين بعض الشيئ تريد ان تكون واقعى اذا فلنتحدث بمصادر .............. لكن بدايه من المؤكد ان مصر عندها خبرات كتير متراكمة ومتنوعة فى مجال الصواريخ وساعدت برامج دول مثل العراق وكوريا الشمالية . العراق طور صواريخ Scud لـ" الحسين والعباس " و كوريا الشمالية بدأت واستمرت فى برنامج صاروخى اصبح فيما بعد الاساس لبرامج دول اخرى كايران وسوريا وليبيا .......... مصر اقامت شراكة مع اربع دول فى مشروعات مختلفة فى وقت واحد تقريبا , وسترى كيف كان العمل على مشروع Badr-2000 مع العراق والارجنتين , وكان التعاون بين مصر والعراق يمضى فى اتجاه تطوير الموجود لدى العراق من Scud لاستخدامها فى حربه مع ايران , ومصر مع كوريا الشمالية كانت العلاقة اكثر عمق وامتدت من تطوير Scud و Project T الى Nodong , TaepoDong ............ ولنبدء من البداية ...............
- اقتباس :
- In1979 or 1980, Egypt provided North Korea
with the first examples of its Soviet R-17E (Scud B) missiles. North Korea reverse-engineered the 300km range missiles and provided Egypt with significant access to its technologies, sending technical specialists to Egypt and allowing Egyptian technical teams to visit North Korean production sites. North Korea also provided technical documentation and engineering drawings for the missiles. In 1986, North Korea began production of the new Hwasong 5 (Scud B variant), and by the next year exported the missile to Egypt. In 1989, Egypt test fired its version of the 300km range Scud B
و هذا يعنى ان كوريا الشمالية حصلت فى سنه 1980 على عدد من Scud B , وبعد 6 سنوات انتجت نسختها " Hwasong " , و التى حصلت مصرعلى اعداد منها وبعد 3 سنوات جربنا النسخه المصرية " , Egypt test fired its version " من Scud B بمدى 300 كيلو............. بعد ما حصلنا على engineering drawings , technical documentation ............ و استمر التعاون فيما سمى Project T .......
- اقتباس :
- With North Korean help, the Project T missile has improved the capabilities of the ‘Scud
B' to a range of 450 km (279 miles) using more advanced construction materials and fuel design. It is believed that it maintains the 985 kg payload equipped with high explosives. Production is believed to have been started in 1990 and 90 missiles were produced over a five year period. In February 1999, Cairo's Al-Ahram reported that "Egypt is continuing its efforts to develop and produce Scud-B missiles . . . In the first half of 1998 Egypt continued to acquire ballistic missile components and related equipment from North Korea. This activity is part of a long-range program of cooperation between these two countries in the sphere of ballistic missiles . Reports indicate that Egypt is developing a short range ballistic missile that exceeds the projected range of the Project T. These reports point toward their working on this weapon since 2003. Because of its projected range and payload, as well as its aid from NorthKorea, it appears to be similar to the ‘Scud C' model, but with a solid propellant -------------------------- Egypt is believed to have produced the Scud-Bindigenously - perhaps modifying them to extend their range - with some North Korean assistance. An enhanced Scud-C (called "Project T"), with range/payload of 450 km/985 kg, is reported to have been developed and may be in service. In cooperation with the French Société Nationale des Poudres et Explosifs (SNPE), Egypt has developed, produced, and deployed the Sakr-80 rocket as a replacement for the aging Frog missiles. The Sakr factory is responsible for producing the warheads, launchers and fire control systems for the Sakr-80. Various warheads were under development there in early 1988, including an HE armor piercing warhead, an antipersonnel/antimateriel submunition warhead, and an antitank minelet warhead; however, a chemical warhead was not planned. According to press reporting from June 1990, China has signed a protocol with Egypt to help modernize the Sakr missile factory, "enabling it to produce a newer version of Soviet antiaircraft missiles, the surface-to-surface Scud-B and Silkworm and the Egyptian Sakr rockets وكان التعاون كبير و مفيد للطرفين .................... |
| Cairo can now produce its own version of the Soviet Scud-B missile, which can deliver nuclear or chemical warheads up to 300 kilometers. It is also developing a more advanced Scud-C version June 1991 The BBC investigative television news program "Panorama" reports that Arab British Dynamics, a British Aerospace and Arab Organization for Industrialization joint venture, is cooperating with North Korea in Egypt to develop and manufacture an extended-range version of the Scud-B, or Scud-C. The report also cites unidentified "intelligence sources" as saying that the program is nearing the production stage. According to the Wall Street Journal, the plant will begin producing missiles in eight to 12 weeks. September 1991 According to Danny Leshem of the Tel Aviv Jaffe Center for Strategic Studies, Egypt will produce enhanced Scud-C missiles with a range of up to 600km. January 1992 Flight International reports that the British government has persuaded British Aerospace (BAe) to try to end its involvement with an Egyptian company that is developing Scud variants. The British government learned in 1991 that Arab British Dynamics (ABD) in Cairo, which is 30 percent owned by British Aerospace,planned to make Scud components. The British Foreign tried to persuade British Aerospace to pull out of the joint venture, and BAe has negotiated unsuccessfully with the Egyptian government to end ABD's work on Scuds. ABD was created in the 1970s as a partnership between BAe and the Arab Organization for Industrialization to build British Swingfire anti-tank missiles | بالتعاون مع كوريا الشمالية والقدرات الذاتية استطاعت مصر ان تصل الى انتاج نسخة مصرية من Scud بمدى 600 كيلو وكان التعاون حالة خاصة جدا ..................
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| The case of the North Korean sale of missile and related technology to Egypt, that was recently discovered, offers insights into how these sales are conducted. In August 2002, a North Korean couple based in Bratislava in Slovakia, was found buying dual-purpose goods in China, Russia and Belarus and then exporting them to the Kader Factory for Developed Industries, an Egyptiangovernment-funded military complex in Cair
It is now clear that the "Egyptian connection" played an important role in North Korea's missile development which grew along with its sales. Pyongyang produced its first missile in 1976, a SA-2/HQ-2 SSM with a range of only 60-160 km. But its more advanced missile program began in the early 1980s when the Egyptians supplied North Korea with Soviet-made Frog artillery rockets and Scud B missiles - liquid-fuelled, surface to-surface missiles that can deliver 1,000-kilogram payload up to 300 kilometers away
Egypt has been receiving help in missile development from North Korea for about 20 years. But Cairo has been forced to turn to Western firms because of North Korea's lack of expertise in developing solid-fuel missile engines.
The intelligence sources said Egypt had been receiving missile components from two unidentified German companies until about 1994. Over the last year, Egypt has renewed contacts with the German firms. The sources said the German government was not aware of the Egyptian effort.
Egypt’s participation in the Hwasong 6 effort appears to have been as a purchaser of technologyrather than as a co-developer. With the failure of the “Condor II” project (known as Vector in Egypt) in late 1989, the Hwasong 6 assumed a higher level of importance for Cairo. In May 1990, shortly before the first test launch of the Hwasong 6, President Hosni Mubarak visited P’yongyang. While in the DPRK capital, he is believed to have visited the 125 Factory where the Hwasong 6 is assembled. Although Egypt is not known to have received entire Hwasong 6 missiles from the DPRK, it has received Hwasong 6 components and related technologies
| مصر لعبت دور هام في برنامج الصاروخي لكوريا الشمالية ودعمه لينمو وتنمو مبببعاته و يستمر حتى الـ TaepoDong ..............At the same time it was working with North Korea, Egypt began a secret project with Argentina and Iraq to build a 1,000km-range missile known as the Condor-II in Argentina and the Badr-2000 in Egypt. "The goal was to develop a missile in Argentina and then pass the cookbook to Egypt and Iraq," says a knowledgeable U.S. official. The project began in 1982,with Egypt promising to help Argentina with technology and with Iraq paying the bills. The Condor-II/Badr-2000 was a solid-fuel,two-stage missile designed to fly 800-1,200 kilometers with a 500-kilogram payload.
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| وفى نفس الوقت الذى كان فيه التعاون مع كوريا الشمالية كبير كان هناك محاور اخرى تعمل عليها مصر بالعمل مع العراق على تطوير مخزونه من الـ Scud وفى ذات الوقت الشراكة مع الارجنتين فى مشروع Condor او Badr-2000 وهذا التعاون يحتاج الى الكثير من الشرح و التوضيح ................ |
| | | bird eyes
عريـــف أول
الـبلد : التسجيل : 25/08/2011 عدد المساهمات : 114 معدل النشاط : 121 التقييم : 2 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| | | | Fawzy
خبير استراتيجي
الـبلد : العمر : 45 المهنة : الادارة المزاج : Rothmans التسجيل : 19/08/2007 عدد المساهمات : 2069 معدل النشاط : 684 التقييم : 116 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| موضوع: رد: ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... السبت 22 أكتوبر 2011 - 0:03 | | | الـ Condor او الـ Pershing Nasser and the missile age in the Middle East - اقتباس :
- Shortly after it began working with North Korea,
Egypt hedged its bets on another secret program. In cooperation with Argentina and Iraq, Cairo initiated a plan to produce an 800 to 1,200km range ballistic missile; it was called Condor II in Argentina, Badr-2000 in Iraq, and Vector in Egypt The three countries planned to develop the missile in Argentina and then to pass the design plans to Egypt and Iraq. The project began in 1982, with Egypt promising to supply technology and Iraq paying the bills. Production was supposed to begin in the Military Factory 90 outside of Cairo هكذا كان طموح مصر و من ثم بدء السباق و العمل المكثف ................. Containing missile proliferation: strategic technology واستمر البرنامج بالعمل ..................... - اقتباس :
However in 1989 the United States arrested an Egyptian-born rocket scientist attempting to smuggle restricted military supplies from the United States to Egypt, including missile nose cones and the heat resistant carbon fiber required for the Condor II missiles. Wire taps also implicated Egyptian Defense Minister Abdel Hamil Abu Ghazala in the scandal. Following these revelations, U.S. President George H.W. Bush personally contacted Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak regarding Americanconcerns. Under pressure from the United States and other MTCR members,Egypt withdrew from the Condor II program.This setback did not deter Egypt from continuing research into medium-rangeballistic missiles, possibly in response to the 1991 Gulf War Duringthe war, Saddam Hussein launched ballistic missiles at Israeli cities,frightening the Israeli populace. Egyptian decision-makers and strategists therefore saw the potential strategic impact of ballistic missiles. Although Egypt remained at peace with Israel, the potential for future conflict could not be ruled out and this likely reinforced interest in ballistic missiles as a strategic deterrent to the dominantIsrael Defense Forces و استطعنا بخبرتنا ان نمتلك تكنولوجيا الوقود الصلب والسائل كما كشف اللواء محمد على بلال مؤخرا ............. - اقتباس :
بعضالتقارير ربطت بين قرارالإقالة وبين برنامج تطويرصواريخ كوندور2 متوسطة المدى، الذي أثار حفيظة أميركا وإسرائيل، فما حقيقة ذلك؟ كنت مشاركا في هذا الموضوع، وأميركا لم تضغط ضدأبو غزالة في هذا الأمر.. والموضوع أننا كنا نعمل سرا على تطوير الوقود الخاص بهذه الصواريخ (بالتعاون مع العراق والأرجنتين) لكي تصل إلى مدى طول. وبالفعل وصلنا إلى المراحل النهائية من التطوير، وبدأنا في الإعداد لحفل كبير لإعلان قدرة مصر على تطوير هذه الصواريخ. ولم نجد مشاكل فى توفير باقى التكنولوجيا المطلوبه من مصادر غربية متنوعة ............
- اقتباس :
[center]Asecret French government report saysEgypt attempted to buy 200 MSD 80 missile guidance systems from French electronics maker SAGEM in 1987. They were to be transferred to Iraq for the Condor II missile. France denied Egypt's request and offered the less precise MSL 800 system instead, which Egypt declined. The Independent reports that the German company Messerchmitt-Boelkow-Blohm (MBB) coordinated the Condor project from 1979 to 1985, assisting Iraq, Egypt, Argentina, and Romania, in developing the missile with a 600-mile range. After 1985, MBB technicians established a firm called Consen to carry on the work in Switzerland. Due to the sensitivity of the project, its suppliers sought to conceal their participation after 1985. To accomplish this, work on the Condor-II was taken over by a consortium of companies known as "Consen," including some of Europe's defense industry giants. The whole operation was headquartered in Munich and used foreign subsidiaries. Press reports have linked several supplier firms to the project, including SNIA-BPD, a subsidiary of Italy's Fiat; Transtechnica, a subsidiary of MBB; the French company Sagem; and the German firm MAN. Nearly 20 others were reported to have played a role in procuring technologies for the Condor, includingcompanies named Delta Consult, Ifat, Desintec, Condor Projeckt and Aerotec وانتهى التعاون بعد ان كشفت ابعاده و دور كل دوله فيه .................. Los Angeles Timesلكن المشروع استمر مع 14 محرك ..................... - اقتباس :
Egyptian missile experts were in Iraq working on the Condor-II. From 1987 until the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait in 1990, Egyptian experts were working alongside Iraqis at a missile complex about 40 kilometers south of Baghdad. In August 1989, an explosion at the site killed hundreds of workers, including Egyptian military engineers. Egyptian-Iraqi missile cooperation included work on extending the range of Scud missiles as well on the Condor-II. As part of the deal, Cairo had always planned to import the means to produce its own version, the Badr-2000. Egypt received some technology from Argentina and started to build its own production facilities, but critical technology was still missing in the late 1980s. Jane's Defence Weekly reportedthat a 1988 "dummy test" in Argentina, which had included launch preparation and software trials, showed the Condor to have significant technical problems. Its development was not complete when, under pressure from the United States, Argentina decided to cancel its participation in the project in 1990 Consequently,Egypt independently continued development of the Condor II technology under its "Vector" missile program. A 1992 Pentagon report said that the Vector had a potential 1,200km range. In a 1998 report to congress, the CIA indicated that "Egypt continues its efforts to develop and produce...the two-stage Vector short-range ballistic missile , Since the 1998 CIA report, there have been no additional public reports released on the Vector program, and it remains unclear if the program progressed beyondthe research stage "In Egypt, the Condor [Badr-2000] has never entirely died,but it is on life support--a nurse monitors the vital signs and some research is being conducted, but full resuscitation is unlikely," says a State Department official. The full extent of Egypt's secret missile cooperation with Iraq before and after the Gulf War is still not known. Cairo has refused requests for information about the Condor-II from the U.N. inspectors in Iraq charged with monitoring Saddam's continuing missile efforts.
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ولم يتوقف المشروع رغم كل الضغوط ومع المحركات والتكنولوجيا وسنوات من العمل استمرالعمل .................... - اقتباس :
Egypthasobtained components for guidance systems from German companies in arenewed effort to complete a medium-range ballistic missile Europeanintelligence sources said the Egyptian orders were placed over the lastyear, with the latest one submitted in February. They said theEgyptian government bought the components from Germany through front companies.The missile transaction was traced by both European and U.S. intelligenceservices, the sources said. They said the components were delivered from Germany to Japan, where the shipment disappeared. They said the components were sent to North Korea for modification and are now believed to be in Egypt. "This can be regarded as a serious effort by Egypt to finish its missileprogram," an intelligence source said. "The Egyptians can't get these components through their regular suppliers, so they turned to theGermans." Egypt is said to be pursuing several medium- and intermediate-range ballistic missile programs, some of themlaunched in the late 1980s. These include the Project T missile, with arange of 450 kilometers, the Al Bader with a range of up to 900 kilometers, and the Vector missile, with a range of up to 1,200 kilometers. The Al Bader was based on the Condor missile in a program that was launched with Argentina and Iraq. The United States pressured Argentinato withdraw from the program in the early 1990s and the UnitedNations embargo prevented Iraq from participating in the missile development.Egypt is said to be continuing the Al Bader and its other missile programs with North Korean help. Intelligence sources from Europeand the United States said Cairo obtains Western and European systems and sends them to Pyongyang for reverse engineering and modification for Egypt's missile program. Egypt has been receiving help in missile development from North Korea for about 20 years. But Cairo has been forced to turn to Westernfirms because of North Korea's lack of expertise in developing solid-fuel missile engines.The intelligence sources said Egypt had been receiving missile components from two unidentified German companies until about 1994. Over the last year, Egypt has renewed contacts with the German firms. The sources said the German government was not aware of the Egyptian effort. The regime of Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak aims to complete a two-stage solid-fuel missile. The sources said Egypt has resumed cooperation with Iraq on missile development. They said much of the missile development takes place in neighboring Libya. A U.S. intelligence source confirmed that Western agencies have been tracking Egypt's missile development programs and its renewed contacts with German firms. The source said he does not believe President George Bush will raise the issue with Mubarak. In March, a group of congressional members asked Mubarak whether Egypt was developing medium- or intermediate-range missiles. Mubarak denied this.Fortheir part, military commanders pledged to maintain Egypt'sstrength. Defense Minister Hussein Tantawi said the military would increase training and weapons procurement to maintain battle readiness."We do not call for war," Tantawi told members of Egypt's northern command. "Our armed forces are strong to be a deterent against any attempt to commit aggression against this great nation
اما الاخوة فى كوريا الشمالية فقد كانوا يواجهون مشاكل مع الوقود والتوجية وكان الـ Nodong فى انتظار اللمسة المصرية ولكن هذا حديث آخر ............. - اقتباس :
Bytheyear 2,000, if Egyptian-North Korean cooperation continues at its present level, Egypt also could gain access to North Korea's more advanced "Nodong" missile.
ما رايك الان بالمنطق الذى تتحدث عنه ................ |
| | | eshaker
رقـــيب
الـبلد : المزاج : رايق التسجيل : 02/10/2011 عدد المساهمات : 218 معدل النشاط : 312 التقييم : 3 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| موضوع: رد: ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... الثلاثاء 1 نوفمبر 2011 - 19:48 | | | يا اخي بالله عليك عايز اعرف شيء عندما تم وقف البرنامج الصاروخي اكتفت مصر بالنسخه اسكود القديمه بدون تحديث وما هو المدي لاكبر صاروخ مصري والاعداد وما هي المسافه التي تستطيع مصر ضرب العمق الاسرائيلي بها معلش الاساله كتير لكن مهمه ونفسي اعرفها اللي عارف ياريت يقول [img][/img][img][/img] |
| | | raed1992
لـــواء
الـبلد : العمر : 32 المهنة : Junior Android Developer المزاج : جميل ولذيذ طول ما انت بعيد عن مصر...هااك التسجيل : 17/09/2010 عدد المساهمات : 7246 معدل النشاط : 6822 التقييم : 303 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| موضوع: رد: ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... الثلاثاء 1 نوفمبر 2011 - 20:38 | | | - eshaker كتب:
- يا اخي بالله عليك عايز اعرف شيء عندما تم وقف البرنامج الصاروخي اكتفت مصر بالنسخه اسكود القديمه بدون تحديث وما هو المدي لاكبر صاروخ مصري والاعداد وما هي المسافه التي تستطيع مصر ضرب العمق الاسرائيلي بها معلش الاساله كتير لكن مهمه ونفسي اعرفها اللي عارف ياريت يقول [img][/img][img][/img]
انت داخل ترمى تعليق وخلاص العاده من غير اى حاجه اقرى اخر صفحتين من الموضوع بس يمكن تفهم وتعرف الحقيقه اللى بتسأل عنها بالمناسبه الكلام بالعربى وبالانجليزى ياريت ماتطلعش فى الاخر ثقافتك لاتينى |
| | | hefny_m
لـــواء
الـبلد : المهنة : مهندس التسجيل : 13/12/2010 عدد المساهمات : 2312 معدل النشاط : 2199 التقييم : 16 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| موضوع: رد: ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... الثلاثاء 1 نوفمبر 2011 - 20:52 | | | |
| | | eshaker
رقـــيب
الـبلد : المزاج : رايق التسجيل : 02/10/2011 عدد المساهمات : 218 معدل النشاط : 312 التقييم : 3 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| موضوع: رد: ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... الثلاثاء 1 نوفمبر 2011 - 21:09 | | | - raed1992 كتب:
- eshaker كتب:
- يا اخي بالله عليك عايز اعرف شيء عندما تم وقف البرنامج الصاروخي اكتفت مصر بالنسخه اسكود القديمه بدون تحديث وما هو المدي لاكبر صاروخ مصري والاعداد وما هي المسافه التي تستطيع مصر ضرب العمق الاسرائيلي بها معلش الاساله كتير لكن مهمه ونفسي اعرفها اللي عارف ياريت يقول [img][/img][img][/img]
انت داخل ترمى تعليق وخلاص العاده من غير اى حاجه اقرى اخر صفحتين من الموضوع بس يمكن تفهم وتعرف الحقيقه اللى بتسأل عنها بالمناسبه الكلام بالعربى وبالانجليزى ياريت ماتطلعش فى الاخر ثقافتك لاتينى شكرا |
| | | alkingamr
مســـاعد
الـبلد : العمر : 30 التسجيل : 08/12/2011 عدد المساهمات : 416 معدل النشاط : 539 التقييم : 12 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| موضوع: رد: ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... الجمعة 9 ديسمبر 2011 - 9:54 | | | اللهم انصر المسلمين فى كل مكان |
| | | القاتل الشرس
مســـاعد أول
الـبلد : العمر : 34 المهنة : STUDENT المزاج : الي العلا في سبيل المجد التسجيل : 04/01/2012 عدد المساهمات : 506 معدل النشاط : 474 التقييم : 11 الدبـــابة : الطـــائرة : المروحية :
| موضوع: رد: ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... الجمعة 27 يناير 2012 - 1:23 | | | |
| | | | ســـلاح الـــردع الاستــراتيجـــى .... " الــمــصـــرى " ... | |
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